Official Luthiers Forum!

ZOOT suit?

Ron

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OLD MAN formerly (and formally) known as:

Ron Wisdom

Somewhere in the middle of Arkansas......

Actually I shave the moustache before putting on my Zoot Suit.

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Beautiful and unusual tone woods at a reasonable price.
http://www.rctonewoods.com/RCT_Store
The Zootman
1109 Military Rd.
Kenmore, NY 14217
(716) 874-1498

Cool

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Beautiful and unusual tone woods at a reasonable price.
http://www.rctonewoods.com/RCT_Store
The Zootman
1109 Military Rd.
Kenmore, NY 14217
(716) 874-1498

[QUOTE=Hesh1956] OK, got it, I got rid of the moustache as you wished. Any other changes that you want me to make?


[/QUOTE]

When bored luthiers get all kinds of creepy

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CVT Inc.
A tour of our shop (Somewhat outdated)
My Personal eBay profile. BCWoodBug

What a great thread this has turned out to be. One of the reasons I love this forum is because subjects like this are brought into the open and discussed. They are not thrown into a dark vault and labeled "Top Secret - Eyes Only."

I think that sometimes, we as Sponsors, are thought of as part of "The Machine", (or people who are getting wealthy from wood sales), when, speaking ONLY for myself, nothing could be farther from the truth. I'm just a guy struggling to bring in another loaf of bread for my wife and me. To tell the truth, most of the time I barely cover my expense of being a Sponsor at this great forum.

But I do provide a service to the people who have the same addiction that I have, and this in itself gives me a great feeling of contributing to something I love.

Having said that, I am protective about my little business, but I know that Lance and Brock are too. Hence their replys in this thread. Shane hit the nail on the head with his post. I also, often send things out without a profit, or at a loss, because I know that someone needs it. And I know what it is like to "need" a piece of wood. I also have gotten concerned about posts that are in direct conflict with my business. In my early days I even wrote to Brock once about one. But since then I've come to realize that this forum protects the people who pay to advertise, as well as the people who do not advertise at all.

I guess what it all comes down to is the people who run the forum. Lance and Brock. They are doing a wonderful job of keeping things organized and running smoothly. I know that my little business is in good hands, because I've seen the integrity of both of these men. Sure, they often get bogged down in the operation, but they are there trying to keep it all together, so we have a place to ask questions, get answers to questions, buy product and if one is a Sponsor, sell product. And we have a place where eveyone can give their thoughts on a touchy subject like this. I for one, love a place where I can post about guitar building, or go completely O.T. and post about fishing if I want.

I also appreciate the fact that I can call Shane, Bob C., Steve or any of the other FINE sponsors if I need a certain piece of wood or some specific info, and not be seen as a competitor, but as a friend. (and believe me, I have done that a whole bunch.) I have developed nothing but friendship with my fellow sponsors, and other than my church, I don't know where you could find that kind of relationship. What I'm saying is that I'm protective of their business also. Without their advice, knowledge, sources and patience, my little business would flounder and and drift away. The same thing is true of the people who are not Sponsors. Whitout you, all of our businesses would fail.

It's funny, but when Brad had his blowout sale, I was actually enjoying the frenzy that was taking place. I don't see Brad, or any other sponsors as a threat. I just see them as fellow sponsors, who I depend on, to keep me on my toes, to be a source of info, and who are friends. I ask you, in this day and age, how is that possible?

"THIS FORUM ROCKS!"

Very well said my friend.

_________________
Beautiful and unusual tone woods at a reasonable price.
http://www.rctonewoods.com/RCT_Store
The Zootman
1109 Military Rd.
Kenmore, NY 14217
(716) 874-1498

ditto

Mike
White Oak, Texas

I also want to commend Lance and Brock for their hard work in making this forum what is today. This is not the first posting we have had in regard to this matter. As Mario pointed out sometime ago, the OLF would experience growing pains. In the days before the new software and sponsors, when we numbered about 20 people, things could be run a bit looser. At that point, the resources required and the time commitments for Lance were minimal. Back then the members were always willing to pony up the bucks to help Lance keep the forum running and expanding. However, with the addition of 400 more members, the need for software modifications to mimic the function of the original forum (thanks Brock), a dedicated server to host the forum, things became more complicated very quickly. Now, through the support of our sponsors (the only ones I deal with anymore on a regular basis), the OLF has the ability to continue to add new features and value for its members (eg. AG magazine, discount coupons, t-shirt). Lance and Brock have walked a fine line trying to ensure that what we have always appreciated about the OLF is still there, namely the community atmosphere. Growing up is never easy, but there is no stopping it!

Don A38808.7989583333

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Don Atwood
Arlington, VA

What more to add after Doug summarized it so well! WTG Doug!

Thanks for the remarks guys. Lance and I spend a lot of time discussing what the OLF "is" and in the end this is not a forum, but rather it is a "community". What makes it work is the culture, values and integrity of our little society and our members.

It really is YOU that make the OLF what it is.

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Brock Poling
Columbus, Ohio
http://www.polingguitars.com

It appears that this is decided, so I'm not sure why I'm throwing my two cents in. But I will anyway :)

This community has a legitimate need for selling 1 offs of things that we no longer need. Go look at your local newspaper. You see paid ads, with pictures, etc., then you go to the back to the free classifieds and you see non business folks selling their excess stuff. The newspapers recognize that there is really no competition between the paid ads and free ads.

Yes, I've read the posts about the auction site. No, I don't feel that meets what I'm talking about. If I want to go to all the trouble of writing ad copy, responding to bids by unknown people, waiting a week, then having the person flake on me, and then pay the website for that service, then I'll go to ebay, which has a much larger user base. I'm talking about selling my stuff, not buying stuff.

On the other hand, what if I have to sets of X, and I want to sell them at a loss just to get them out of my inventory? I want to type a 2 sentence post, not bother with pictures, have a fixed price, and have somebody post that I know and trust from the forum say "I'll take it". It's a done deal, and no real food was taken off the sponsers tables. Sponsers where I've spent a heck of a lot of money.

That's an important point, I think. I've given a boat load of money (given I'm strictly an amateur, and not a pro or a factory) to the sponsers on here, and so have a lot of us. And we're not supposed to make gentleman deals among ourselves? That rankles a little bit. Yes, there are much bigger issues in life, so don't think I'm posting in anger or even annoyance, but come on. Probably anything I would sell on here came from one of the sponsers in the first place.

Anyway, MIMF runs free classified, I guess that's where I'll sell anything if I have anything to sell. That's not meant as spiteful, or "I'm storming out mad", but it's the reality of the situation.

I typically buy in lots of 5 or ten from sponsers (1 or two when I'm getting to know the dealer), and would want to sell maybe 1 or 2 sets once a year if I realize I have something sitting on the shelves that I am not going to use. That's not a threat to either the sponsers or to the OLF business model, because both are providing a service that everyone recognizes, and that is far superior to anything us non business sellers could ever provide.

It's hard to judge tone in posts, especially when disagreements are being expressed, so I hope you understand it was written with sincere respect towards the owner of this site and the sponsers, but with a friendly, yet different viewpoint on the minor issue of classified ads.


ETA: let's face it. Almost all of us are on a budget. If we make money from a personal sale of extra wood, that money is just going to end up in a sponsers pocket anyway. You know, I'd sell 2 sets of lacewood I'm not going to use so I can get some Macassar from Steve at Colonial (for example). That's the power of an open market. rlabbe38809.4542708333

Sorry, I'm on a roll.

Here's another real example. I bought some Carp. Spruce from Bob. I built a classical, and feel that the wood does not work with my classical design (I'm sure it would if I varied my build, but don't really want to do that). So, I'd like to sell it and buy either some Engelmann, German, redwood, etc., instead.

So, Bob already made his sale, someone on OLF would get a nice deal by me selling it a bit below cost, and then Bob or another sponser would get the money back when I bought the new tops.

Isn't that a win for everybody?

No Roger. It isn't a win. (Sorry for disagreeing, but that is how I see it.)

Certainly there is nothing wrong with the purest form of what you are suggesting, however in practice it will not work out that way. We will end up with people who are selling products for profit coming to the boards trying to dump "a little" inventory. Then we are in a pickle about how to handle it.

The auction area is an egalatarian way to handle these situations. There is nothing that would prevent you from listing the auction in the same 2 sentance format, and since you are well known and trusted on the board I am sure it would sell quick.

The net effect is the same.

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Brock Poling
Columbus, Ohio
http://www.polingguitars.com

Sorry, I just couldn't resist....

My two cents. The auction idea does not appeal to me as much as a classified section does. Perhaps if there was the equivalent of a "buy it now" option, an auction could function like a classified.

I know you guys are trying to do what you believe to be best for the forum overall, and I certainly respect that. Just thought I'd register what I've been thinking.

I am nearly certain the auctions will have a buy it now feature.

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Brock Poling
Columbus, Ohio
http://www.polingguitars.com

Have you ever considered politics, Hesh? YOu have a way with words. Very well said, in all your posts.

Ron

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OLD MAN formerly (and formally) known as:

Ron Wisdom

Somewhere in the middle of Arkansas......

Hey Brian I was thing the same thing. Actually a two bagger.   

_________________
Beautiful and unusual tone woods at a reasonable price.
http://www.rctonewoods.com/RCT_Store
The Zootman
1109 Military Rd.
Kenmore, NY 14217
(716) 874-1498

ditto, what Hesh said

Mike
White Oak, Texas

You just clarified my thoughts on the subject Hesh!

[QUOTE=Brian Hawkins] Sorry, I just couldn't resist....
[/QUOTE]

Thank you!!!!!! That has been troubling me...couldn't stop staring at it

Larry, yeah...Bob was lookin' WAY too good there for awhile... it was way too weird for me.

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"I want to know what kind of pickups Vince Gill uses in his Tele, because if I had those, as good of a player as I am, I'm sure I could make it sound like that.
Only badly."

[QUOTE=Don Williams] Larry, yeah...Bob was lookin' WAY too good there for awhile... it was way too weird for me.
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